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A Collapsed Lung

anonymous

New member
My uncle, who does not have CF, has been in the hospital now for about 2 1/2 weeks and has a collapsed lung. How long does it take for one's lungs to get better? I don't know anything about this, and i'm really worried because it seem like his is lasting longer than it should. He has been on a ventilator for 2 weeks now and they were thinking of giving him a trecheotomy, but decided against it.

I know from stories, that the transition from being on a ventilator and switching to a trecheotomy can be very scary because it makes you have to breath on your own. While the ventilator helps you breath and gives you about 90% of your oxygen. So I'm concerned that the decision for them to decide against the trech would only mean that he might not be capable to do it on his own yet.

Anyon'es experience with having collapsed lungs, please share how long it take to recover or what the normal times would be. What does it take for lungs to come back fully to normal?

Any feedback will very appreciated.
Thanks!
 
L

luke

Guest
anonymous,

It is very tough to prognose "collaped lungs" because they happen with various severities and reasons. Did the doctors tell you what caused the "collapse"?
As for the trach, some times it is hard to get people off of ventilators and doctors have to do a trach. Your uncle would stay on the vent even with the trach, at least for a while. It seems that people are easier to wean off of ventilators once they have trachs(there is medical a reason actually) so that is one of the reasons the doctors mentioned it. Actually trachs are recommeded in pt's on ventialtors for >7days so apparently the doctors are trying not to place one in him. Sorry I can't help more...if you have some specific info I may be eble to help more.


luke, rrt
 

JustDucky

New member
Luke has a good point about trachs, when I worked with ventilators as a nurse, after about a week or so on a vent the docs usually discussed a trach because of the reasons Luke discussed. With a trach, it is usually easier to wean someone off a vent and is more comforatable than an endotracheal tube. Most people require some sort of sedation while on an ET tube, but when trached, they can be fully wakened and able to follow commands while still on a ventilator. The docs usually wean a person fairly slowly depending on how he or she responds to the trials. I am a trached and vented person (have been for almost a year and a half now), probably for different reasons than your dad...I have neuromuscular disease along with my CF and basically my diaphragm quit so I can't breathe on my own. I found that once I was trached, the docs weaned me off of sedation and I was awake. The docs did try to wean me off the vent using various settings and oxygen concentrations, they never did take me off the vent completely because I did not tolerate the changes in the settings. A doc usually never just takes one off a vent until they feel that the person can handle the challenge.
As far as the collapsed lung, it depends why it has happened and how severe. I wish I could give you more specifics. I had a collapsed lung once in my life due to a lung biopsy and it took a few days but the defect was small. As I said, everyone is different. I will keep your dad and your family in my thoughts...Hugs, Jenn <img src="i/expressions/rose.gif" border="0">
 

CowTown

New member
Woops, that was me Mrs. Anony. Guess I didn't log in last night.

Eventhough I'm the one in the family who probably knows the most about lung issues, I've never had a collapsed lung to know anything about what he is going through. It's so scary.


The doctors do not know why any of this has happened to him. Originally my uncle went to the ER for a burst appendix and then something was wrong with his colon, so they repaired his colon in surgery that night. During or after the surgery was when the bottom of his right and left lungs collapsed and were getting little air. So since then he's been on a ventilator. Apparently the vent is doing ALL of his breathing for him, still, 2.5 weeks into this. He has been having high fevers so they think he's fighting an infection, which I guess is why they've been hestitant to start the trecheotomy. He has been heavily sedated this whole time in hopes that his body heals on it's own without him asking questions and getting anxious. Now that his fever is starting to go down, they are planning on giving him a trech this Tues, if all goes well.

So what is that experience like, waking up to a ventilator and a trecheotomy? Is it very difficult to breath? Then when they eventually wean you off the trech, what is that like? Seems like it would be very difficult.

Jenn, do your doctors feel that you've eventually come off both the trech and the vent, at some point? I don't know anything about neuromuscular disease. I'm sorry to hear that you are dealing with all that!!! Thanks for sharing.

Thanks Luke for your thoughts. So, is it true that you can't be taken off of a ventilator without first having a trech? Is that the process?
 

CowTown

New member
One more thing, my uncle is possibly about 150 lbs over weight. How much does this kind of weight effect collapsed lungs?
Thanks.
 

EnergyGal

New member
Hi Kelly

It will be a tough battle for your uncle but in time he will come off the ventilator. The most important thing for him is to try and move as much as he can. If he can sit up on the bed and even try and walk, he will come off the vent within a week or so. THe longer he lays in bed and does not move the harder it will be. The trach at first is very uncomfortable and some people have a big fear of being without oxygen. Getting pass the fear and putting trust in the doctors is important. Since he is overweight I hope he gets the nurses to help move him around. Having a positive attitude and willing yourself to good health is a battle when you are scared.

I had the attitude if I die trying oh well I tried. That got me moitvated. Being on the trach was the scariest and most challenging experience. Walking was very difficult at first but I felt such a sense of accomplishment when I added rounds to my walk each day.

One time, I awoke and my sats started dropping. This was in the middle of the night and I did not believe the nurses and therapist as I felt so relaxed. WEll I asked them to get out my pulse oximter that I had with me and sure enough I was going down in the low ninties. They found out that I went to sleep with my pacimer value (that helps you talk) and you are not suppose to do that. I got some mucus caught in it and that is why my sats started dropping. Fortunately at this point, i still had a trach but was weaned off the ventilator just on room air.

I was trached for a few weeks more than I should because for awhile I just layed around and refused to walk. I have no idea where my head was at but I did not believe I was going to get out that state. One day the nurse said to me, "don't you want to leave the hospital?" That is when I got my act together and said I am going to make it even if I die trying.

I hope your uncle can start moving
 
L

luke

Guest
Kelly,

It seems to me that they "nicked" your uncle's lung while operating on his colon and trying to clean up after the appendix ruptured. It just is not normal for lungs to collapse just because of an abdominal surgery. The infection most likely is due to the ruptured appendix and possibly due to the surgery itself. Your are right about the infection, if it severe enough it causes all kinds of problems (called sepsis) and he may not be able to come off the ventilator until they control his infection. As for his weight, it does play an issue but not so much on his lungs and weaning him off but his overall body health and the amount of stress he can take( his heart specifically). Normally you wean people off(about 95-97% to my experience without having a trach. There are several ways to do it, every doctor has their preference and every patient is differrent. But it is almost always it is done with the ET tube only; trachs are only used in the instance when that doesn't work. Anyway...keep us posted and I will keep him and your family in my prayers.


luke
 

JustDucky

New member
Hi Kelly, I am sorry your uncle is battling so hard to fight infection...more than likely that is why the docs are hesitant to get him off the vent just yet or do a trach. I agree with luke about most folks not needing a trach to wean, only those who are hard to wean or have been on the vent a long time. It is uncomforatable at first, especially to turn your head but I would think being awake with an ET is harder (although I have never experienced being awake with an ET tube, I was switched to a trach and allowed to wake up)...at least it would be for me as I have a very strong gag reflex and hate tubes in general (just ask my gastro when he did an upper endoscopy!) It did get better though, as far as discomfort goes and I learned how to do all of my trach care. Right now, I don't even notice it...absolutely no discomfort except if I have a really bad infection and I am coughing alot.

I do remember waking up for the first time, it was a strange sensation having a machine breathe for me, it wasn't tough to breathe as the machine was doing all of the work but it was still on the scary side to get used to it. I remember putting my hand up to my trach and touching it and realized that I had been trached. I was unable to speak at first, they inflated the cuff, or balloon in the trach so that there would be minimal to no leakage. Being unable to speak was very frustrating, I was either writing what I wanted to say or signing. I was still pretty fragile. After about 3 weeks with the trach, they deflated the cuff some and asked me to speak. They also adjusted my vent settings so that it wouldn't alarm constantly, I still do the same thing at home. I do have what they call a Passy Muir valve, I didn't like it too much but alot of folks like it, especially those off the vent. It basically diverts the airflow back up through your vocal cords and allows you to talk. (If your uncle does wind up with a trach and uses this device, they will teach him as well as the family on how to properly use it as well as cleaning it) I do just fine with what the docs call "minimal air leak" technique, I just drop some of the air in my cuff and talk just fine. I talk so well that people on the phone don't really have a clue that I am trached and on a vent. One thing to remember, a trach doesn't have to be permanent...alot of people that have been trached while under my care as a nurse (to help them wean) get it removed unless there is damage to the windpipe. I hope your uncle fights that infection and gets off the vent soon! And please keep us updated, I am pulling for the guy.

As for your question aboutI whether I will ever come off the vent, the answer is no...my disease is progressive. It is a very rare type of muscular dystrophy that also affects the diaphragm. Occassionaly, the docs will take me off the vent and ask me to breathe on my own for a bit to see what my tidal volume is. It is pretty pathetic usually runs in the 200's (mls), they like to see at least 500 or better and I never do that even sitting straight up or standing. I have tested that myself with my own vent with some adjustments that basically allows me to do all the work and it is always the same, sometimes less if I am tired. My pulmo monitors me carefully as far as the vent goes. My portable vent is pretty small, a LTV 950 and allows me to do different settings for the day and night as well. During the day, I do some of the work as far as breathing goes, at night it switches over to just the machine doing the work. It took awhile to tweak the settings to where I am comfortable with them. The nice thing is, I no longer have to fight to breathe anymore...it took everything in me just to breathe prior to the vent, even with the help of the BiPAP and O2 bleed in. Interestingly, my CF wasnt diagnosed until about 6 months ago.

Well my friend, enough about me...if you have any questions, please don't hesitate to ask. I really don't mind at all. Hugs and prayers going to your whole family, Jenn <img src="i/expressions/rose.gif" border="0">
 
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